TRANSCRIPT: 

00:04

Hello, welcome to the sales show. I'm Maree Kirkpatrick, your sales and business strategist. I'm a mom, a wife, and a multi-business owner myself with over 15 years experience in sales and business. I have worked with startups all the way through to multimillion-dollar companies. I've seen the good, the bad, and the ugly. I love helping service-based businesses make an income as well as an impact. Let's jump into talking about all things sales and business alone.

00:34

Welcome back to the sales show. I'm so pumped to have you here. Today we are talking to the beautiful Dr. Shiromi from the Cloud GP. And I have known Dr. Shiromi me for a little while, we've had really great conversations about business and life and kind of combining it all. But let me tell you a little bit more about her and her official bio. So Dr. Shiromi, has been a doctor for 15 years and obtained her medical degree from Melbourne's prestigious Monash University. I love that she loves chatting with patients listening to their unique stories and helping them get back on track so that they can live life as the best version of themselves, which I'm so passionate about too, because I feel like you don't go into business to burnout. Because that's not really that fun. She has done specialist training with a Fellow of the Royal Australian College of General Practitioners, and has advanced her skills and completed further training in psychology strategies subsequently established a high school mental wellbeing program. Fantastic. I know you are so passionate about these mental health space. And this is why I wanted to bring you on to the SEL show today. Because I know as a business owner, sometimes our mental health can get a little bit can go a little bit off track. And especially for those of us like myself that tend to work on our own, we may have a team, you may not have a team, but a lot of the time we're literally on our own. And so this is why I wanted to bring you on here because I know that our mental health, our mindset, all of that can have a huge impact from a sales perspective. So tell me how all this started for you and why you're so passionate about specifically working with business owners. Yeah, look, mental health for me. And thanks for having me. By the way, it's such a pleasure to talk to you a lovely audience, you know, my passion area is mental health. And most certainly, I love having a chat to business owners and entrepreneurs because I know that we can make such a big difference when it comes to mental health. If someone's struggling, you know, with a bit of intervention, bit of lifestyle change and some psychology strategies, we can really turn it around for people in terms of how things are going. And so, you know, that's why you get into medicine for the warm and fuzzies. And it's so lovely to see someone who is struggling with fatigue, with concentration with burnout with just not feeling themselves and impacting their relationships, both at home and at work and coming in and doing a bit of hard work. And then seeing the good stuff at the other side, which is, you know, work productivity sales, you know, good happy relationships and a feeling of fulfillment. So, I absolutely love this space. Yeah, fantastic. I know that for me, personally, I know that I have been through the ups and downs, highs and lows of business, right, I don't think there's a better personal development journey than business except for maybe parenthood as well. Where just you to stretch out of your comfort zone to be uncomfortable to challenge who you are and who you want to be and kind of create that life that you really want to live. Sometimes we get so stuck in our head that everything feels hard, and we think we can't do it and things like that. I know from my personal experience I have brought in professional psychologists and things like that to work with. Because I know that when I've gone to uplevel, sometimes my stuff comes up, if I stop and think Oh, that's too hard, my business isn't going to grow, my sales aren't going to grow. And so it's not going to happen. So what do you feel like are the biggest challenges that you see with business owners when it comes to dealing with their mindset and their mental health? Yeah, that's a really good question. I think let's talk about stigma to begin with, shall we? Because that's a big one. Yes. In terms of thinking that you should be able to just fix this yourself, right? 

04:08

The idea of feeling bad about coming in to see your GP or seeking psychological assistance, because what's wrong with you pull your socks up, you're capable person, you've done this and this and this, and why can't you get ahead of this. This is something we really have to reframe when it comes to business, people seeking mental health assistance, because we don't do it with any other medical condition, right? No one comes in to see me in terms of, you know, having severe abdominal pain and feeling like they should have fixed their appendicitis by themselves or that they should have just had deeper breaths to fix their asthma. There's just no such thing as that. But when it comes to mental health, there's this perception of you coming in to seek help is a sign of you being a failure, you're not being able to pull it together, which is completely incorrect. It's a medical condition. That's how we need to frame it to begin with because we've reframe it like that you can get professional assistance and get better and that's the same thing when it comes to any aspect of business, isn't it like if you need someone who's a professional in sales and marketing

05:00

You go and see someone to get help. If you need someone that's a private Facebook ads, you get you level up. And so that's what we need to sort of see this as first as something that you can come out for, you know, seek our help without needing to feel like you're a failure or that you're going to be judged. And then we can work with you to get you better. Absolutely. And imagine if every single person felt happy and safe, and had the ability to say, you know, what, I am struggling at the moment who can help with my village or my support around me that I can reach out to who I think that's a really good point. And I think, you know, talking about mental health and talking about not feeling gracious and feeling sad and hopeless, we're talking about anxiety and talking about being stressed and it taking over your life is a really hard conversation, let's accept that as well. Right? It's a very vulnerable situation to be in. And I think sometimes, maybe if you don't have a good GP, it can be a hard conversation to have, you know, that stuff isn't fun to talk about with family or friends alone, a complete stranger that you're worried is going to judge you. 

05:59

So that's another cheapest probably to get in there and to try and establish relationships with people now, even if you're well, so that if you are up the creek, come a few months or a few years, you've already got someone who's a good egg who you trust, I think that's really important that seeing someone you know, whether it be doing face to face stuff, or even online stuff, you need to trust the person that's behind the screen, or in front of you telling you to do this. And to do that, because at that point, when you are experiencing symptoms, it's really hard to get on board. You know, one of the major symptoms of depression is anhedonia, which is lack of motivation. And so sometimes I've got patients that really don't want to do the things that I'm telling them to do. But they do it because they trust me. And they trust that what I'm saying is coming from a good place and with professional experience, and they'll do it and get better. So sometimes it's a case of, you know, leaving that decision-making to someone that you trust, but you need to sort of try and formalize that relationship before you get to that point. Ideally, yeah. And in regards to the motivation, because it's interesting that you say that on other people that are listening, I have moments where I'm like, where's my motivation? Like, I have this high expectation of myself that I should wake up every day and be like, on ready to go all guns blazing. Right. And I also acknowledge that that's not realistic, either, we can't always be on so what how would someone know whether it's a lack of motivation? Or if it's something a little bit more than that? And then, once they hit that hill, that is a really important question. And it's actually a really tricky question to figure out as well. Because, you know, if we talk about depression, we're talking about sadness, we're talking about lack of motivation, reduced concentration, things like disturbance and appetite, feeling hopeless, worthless, guilty, feeling blame, I mean, sometimes they think, all of the above, right. And then with anxiety, it can be things like sleep disturbance and feeling stressed and and overtaking, you know, your day to day life and all of that. 

07:46

So it can be very hard to figure out what's going on. I think if it's permeating into your life, into your enjoyment of life and permeating into more than just that moment. So you know, for instance, you start to get stressed more about you lose sleep, it's impacting your relationships with your partner, or your kids or your work colleagues. That's when alarm bells should go off that maybe you should check this out. And I think here's the other thing that we need to really concentrate on is that people get caught up in this, I don't want to waste the GPS time. What if it's not depression and anxiety? What if it's just me having a bad day? And so a lot of the time, people will come in and say to me, Hey, you got to show me, I'm here to see you about this. But it's probably nothing. It's probably nothing like no one says that about any other medical condition. They're like, something's wrong, fix me. But there's your sense of you needing to have a medical degree and have a clear diagnosis before you even come in to see me. So my advice is, if you think something is up, and you have that gut feeling, or if family or friends have mentioned that you might be struggling, because that's a big thing to get feedback from them as well go in and just have a chat to your GP or start to think about seeking help. Because I've never, in my years of practice, had someone come in to see me for a mental health appointment and thought, Gosh, that person didn't need to come in what a waste of time, it just doesn't happen. It doesn't happen at all. It's quite the opposite, where I'm like, Oh, bugger, I wish this person coming early. It sounds like they've been struggling for weeks or months by themselves.

09:03

 And tell me a little bit more because I know that we've had conversations outside of obviously off this podcast, about your business and where that fits in with people sometimes not being able to get to the help that they need at the time that they need it right? Because it's not like you go, Okay, next week, I'm gonna plan on having a really bad slumpy day and sometimes it's a week sometimes it's a day. I know for me sometimes it's been like a couple of months. And I'm like, why am I meant to be doing this? Am I not on purpose? You know, like, all that sort of stuff tends to come up. Yeah. So tell me why you've started the cloud GP because I know that something that you're really passionate about and I think it is something that is definitely needed out there in the world. Thanks. Very Yeah, look, like I said, mental health, my passion and so we were talking about how hard it is to come in to see the GPS, my patients will come in. We'll do a diagnostic workup. We might do some investigations and have a chat and then diagnose someone with depression or anxiety, and then I hand them a referral to

10:00

see a psychologist. And then they call up the psychologist and there's a six to eight week in Metro a three month wait to see the psychologist if you're rural, which is not what you want to hear you've come in, you've bravely been vulnerable and told us everything and you need things often when you're seeing us you need things fixed yesterday, your marriage might be on the rocks, your business might be, you know, its last legs because you're not able to function. And so leaving people on support in that time is really, really dangerous. This is a time critical period. Because if we leave people on support, and we don't help them then and then when they need it, a few things can happen. One, they can get worse, you know, depression anxiety to not to just magically disappear by themselves, they tend to get worse, you can go from, you know, maybe feeling a little bit of fatigue and loss of concentration, sadness, to really being at the other end of the spectrum. And even struggling with things like suicidal thoughts, and really feeling unwell and a shell of yourself, the other thing that can happen is that people can just drop off and they can go, You know what, it's too hard. I don't want to do this anymore, I can't believe that I can't get help, I'm not worth it.

10:57

 And then we never see them again, both those are not great, we might see them down the track when they're really really unwell. So what we've come up with, with the cloud GP, is we've come up with an online, self directed mental health program. It's called first steps to overcoming depression and anxiety. So yeah, it's an online program, which you can access, it's not too big. So it only takes you three days to do it with our commitment, and you go through and it's the stuff that I wish every GP would share with their patients when it came to that consult to make no positive change and to get them feeling better, even before they say the psychologist. So we go through things like stigma, what's holding you back from sick that hill, we go through and reframing that because we need to get you on the good base to get you better. We'd go through things like the medical diagnostic workup. So you understand your condition and understand the symptoms and what you're dealing with. Because informed patients have better health outcomes. We just know that lifestyle interventions, we go through some mini psychological skills training, we talk about social connection, and all of that sort of stuff. And so it gets people gets the ball rolling, it's and it's stuff that you can implement at home, and personalized your specific circumstance and mores, whether it be business or anything else, and so that you can get get started on feeling better. And like I said before living your best life. Yeah. How good is that? How good is it that you have, and I talked about this a lot with my clients, and even with people in her sales club that a lot of the time people build something, and then they try and find someone to sell it to, like, constantly kind of keep pushing and forcing and like wearing all over people to try and sell stuff, right. But I feel like you have taken that beautiful approach of like, what is a challenge that's going on in the market? Where's the gap? How can I fill it to serve more people? I think that is freaking brilliant. So what Donald that thank you tell me, what sort of differences have you seen the people's business and sales because I know that sometimes when people aren't making sales and their business isn't flourishing, and a lot of the time people will say their business is flourishing based on the dollars coming in, they put their self worth on the dollars coming in. If people say no to them, when they've tried to sell them something. It's very personal for a lot of people, especially women. 

13:03

And I understand that right. But once someone has helped with their mindset, and then mental health, what sort of changes have you seen from a business and a growth perspective? Yeah, I mean, this is the good stuff, right? This is the warm and fuzzy stuff that we were talking about before you see people have a lot more clarity, a lot more clarity, when it comes to what their aims are, what they want to achieve, how they're going to go about achieving it and, and setting really realistic expectations, I think we can get all stuck in that thing of wanting something massive, but not knowing how to get there. And sometimes it's mental health stuff, you know, that logical processing just goes out the window. You know, before you may have been very organized, unable to really think critically, and all of a sudden you find those skills. So we go back and we train people to help them go step by step. And so that big thing becomes a small thing with lots of steps. And so when you're not feeling so overwhelmed, it's so much easier to get the task done, isn't it when you have got little steps that you know you want to achieve. So we see that improvement we see just general happiness and work fulfillment when it comes to work, work life balance, because people aren't constantly worrying about this and that with work they've, you know, able to compartmentalize their worries and think about that process logically in terms of compartmentalizing the stress and the worry so that doesn't overtake life. And so you know, when you have someone that goes home and they're happy in happy relationships, they're able to connect with their kids, they're able to section out time and their week to look after themselves to go for a swim or to you know, do a few laps around the oval while their kids during cricket practice. You see that flow on when it comes to business the way that they speak to customers, the way that they take on rejection, right that it not be the end of the world all of that sort of thing is influenced by mental health and well being. And as I said before, I know that when I have gone to take big leaps that feel really uncomfortable and feel like who am I to approach a bigger company or feel like I couldn't really make a difference and help them that

15:00

When I've kind of pulled in those specialists and going, You know what, I know that this isn't working for me. And so tell me what sort of check ins should people be doing to make sure that they're met? Like if their business is struggling? How do they determine whether it's their mental health mindset II type stuff, rather than sales strategy or sales processes or real, like business foundation II type stuff? Yeah, that's a really good question. I think it's really hard as well, because for those people that have a small business, sometimes you're working alone aren't cheering off it is without too many people around. It's not like when you're working in a big corporate, and you're out for lunch with people and have that chat and that connection, so it can feel like a bit of a lonely place. So I think there are ways to mitigate that I think it's really important to first and foremost be have those checking discussions with people around you. So whether it be your your partner, whether it be your you know, siblings, or your parents or whoever's in your local community or your mother's group, have a chat to them about how you're doing and be open about your worries and struggles and be willing to accept feedback from them. If someone's saying, saying to you look, I think you're struggling or, you know, it sounds like you're not getting much sleep, is it worth you saying someone about that stuff. So being open to that, and not feeling like it's a judgment or criticism. So keeping family contacts and social connection close by, I think beyond that, sometimes it's hard to connect with family when it comes to your business goals, because they don't quite get it, do they, um, they're more worried about you looking after the kids with them, or looking after the finances or the mortgage or whatever it may be. So I think it's really important to connect with like minded people, and people that are going through the same struggles as UI, wherever you are. In business, it's always good to have, you know, mentors who are doing it so well that you aspire to. But it's also good to connect with the people that, you know, if you're starting off, or starting off at or having the same challenges when it comes to getting messaging, right, or trying to navigate social media or feeling uncomfortable about social media. Because half the time just that social connection and talking and being able to vent with people that get it can sometimes even solve the problem in that you just understand that it's not all about you being a failure or anything like that. It's just that's a part of the process of, of learning and making it work in businesses that trial and error. So yet making sure that you connect with the right people and, and listening to people and helping them out and letting them help you out. Having that sort of dynamic relationship. I know when I've worked when I work with a lot of my clients, although they come to me for business and sales strategy processes, and really looking at the financial growth of the business. We also talk about life outside of business. A lot of my clients are moms, I'm a mom. And it's really easy for us to say I'm tired, because I've got kids, I'm tired, because I'm running a business. I'm exhausted because of this. I'm lacking clarity because of that. But when we actually break it down, I will say, Well, is this really a business challenge that we're having? Or do you actually need to do some self care, and I had clients who have said, like, you need to literally factor in, going for a walk, whether it's in the morning, in the middle of the day, whatever it takes for you to let it go. Because a stressed out, burnt out business owner, burnt out mother, burnt out wife, partner, whatever it is, is good for literally no one.

18:10

 Yeah, no one. Absolutely. I mean, it's no wonder why they're being massive Silicon Valley companies spend so much money on looking after the mental well being of their employees, there's a reason for it. And the reason is that work productivity goes up when you are looking after someone ensuring that they've got that work life balance, and they're happy at home, and they're exercising and eating healthy. And I know it's hard. It's really hard when you've got work deadlines and you know, 1,000,001 things on your Monday checklist to do. And always out and you've been told to go over a 30 minute walk, you almost want to run the 15 sprints and come back and get the work done. But you know, it does most certainly pay off down the track if you have these things in place. And even when it comes to business, having time to think creatively and to, you know, problem solve sometimes that's done at the computer or you know, with clients or whatever. But sometimes it's just done when you're having a swim and you're having a break and you haven't got to do 1,000,001 things in that moment. Absolutely. And giving yourself that time and space to be creative and allow and allowing some of your creative juices and your expertise to flow in without the pressure. Yes, absolutely. I've had some of my best ideas come when I've gone you know what, everything feels a little bit overwhelming. I'm gonna go and have a shower for as long as the hot water will last.

19:29

But to me, it's like I have that time to go. Do you know what, step back for a minute? What do we need to do here? Absolutely. And that's a hard call to make when you're by yourself in your bubble. I think sometimes so it can help to get a professional to come in and go home. And this the whole thing it can be overwhelming. Sometimes you look at your lifestyle and you go oh, I'm not eating great. I'm not sleeping Great. I'm on my phone, you know, two minutes before I hit hit the pillow. I'm not really exercising Where do I even start? It's too hard. I'm just gonna not do anything when the key is just to pick one.

20:00

All true things, maybe with one thing to start with, and then in a fortnight and on another, and then in a fortnight add on another. So over time, you start to build a better life work balance and self care routine, all of that because I understand that it can feel, you know, you don't have to start marathon running, if you go from nothing zero to marathon running all of a sudden, if you're not someone that exercises, try and go for a walk around the block, you know, three times a week, and then RBO, twice a week, excuse me. And then after that, increase it to maybe a little bit longer, or increase the pace, and then have a look at your diet and be like, You know what I'm being I'm eating a bit of rubbish, I'm think I'm going to change it to having some fruit every day. So slowly add up, add up, add up, and you can you can get there, the thing that I find really interesting, and that sometimes I catch myself doing as well is when we talk about, you know that lots of things on your plate, lots of deadlines, lacking time, as I said, I've got kids, so a lot of the driveway, like in this time box, gotta go, you got kids and then start your other job, which is motherhood. Yeah, sorting all that sort of stuff out, what's the impact on the lack of good nutrition and the lack of sleep and the lack of rest? And what I would say is constantly burning that and having that hustle mentality of like, the only way I can grow my business is like 100 miles an hour. I'm not about all of that Been there done that got the burnout t shirt not.

21:25

So what's the impact that really it can have when we sought out those key elements? The evidence is astounding, you know, we would need to have a day long podcast to have a discussion about the benefits of exercise and nutrition and sleep when it comes to mental well being like we have so many studies on this stuff. And it's kind of sad that I think even in a GP setting that we life is so busy now that people come in with sometimes a shopping list of things that need to get sorted. And we don't have these big, long chats about holistic health care and preventive health because the outcomes are astounding. And I've seen it in clinic, to be honest, the patients that do implement this stuff, but implemented just a little bit of time when it comes to exercise. And you know, it's not about losing weight. It's not about like I said, getting to be a marathon runner, it's not about having a perfectly healthy diet, you can still have a KitKat if you want now and again.

22:15

Absolutely, it's about sustainable sort of changes, and just going slow and steady. Because we also have to remember that if we don't make these changes, yes, it's going to impact your mental health and your well being but also down the track, you're going to have health stuff come along the way as well chronic health conditions, physical health conditions, which will then impact mental well being and your business. So, you know, there's there's benefits on all fronts when it comes to making small changes. But yeah, the evidence is, is massive when it comes to sleep hygiene and looking after your sleep and making sure you're getting enough sleep and letting your brain rest when it comes to endorphins and exercise. And you know, there's lots of studies about nutrition and having a whole foods diet or you know, a diet similar to sort of Mediterranean origins with good fresh veggies and fruit and fish and lentils and good olive oils, or the wushu crew Japanese diet, which is based on the same thing effectively, if it's come from a tree, or you've put it out of the ground without processing it aches, it's probably good for you. 

23:08

So that sort of mentality of having less processed sugary foods, and having a wholesome diet, the evidence is is really there. It's just that I think our lifestyle now with UberEATS, and time and all that sort of stuff is it's easier to not make those changes and hear those changes, and just push that aside and try and come up with a quick fix, because we're all short on time. Yeah, tell me have you seen? Or what's the experience you've had around business owners that as their success increases, or their business grows, the impact that it's had on their health, their well being their mindset, all that sort of stuff as well? Yeah, well, I mean, you can have, you can have it go wonderfully if you've got sustainable practices in place, right? Like if someone's got from the start, or they've had a burn, it's often that they've had a burnout situation and then they've recalibrated To be honest, you can have a successful thriving massive business and be mentally you know, really well and have boundaries in place when it comes to your health and your well being. You know, it's a common thing in medicine as well, where we think that have went on at work that the whole hospital system will crash and you know, people will dabble know, there's people to fill in, and they'll be okay, they'll figure things out. And so it's about creating long term sustainable boundaries so that you can, you know, make time to eat healthy food and to sit down and to mindfully eat your lunch and not you know, shoving muesli bar in your throat while you're there tapping on the computer. It's about making the time to be able to go for you remember, when I was a registrar doing medicine, my consultant said, Oh, we're all going for, you know, he encouraged us to go for a morning at lunchtime walk to get some sunlight. And I can't tell you the difference that made in terms of just rejuvenating me for the afternoon consults to go out and have some fresh air and chat non-medical stuff with some colleagues, you know, around the block during my lunch break. So it makes huge changes but it's about you creating boundaries for yourself. No one else is going to do that for you. Your boss isn't gonna come to you and say, hey, look, you know, it might be beneficial for you to have it

25:00

Don't be breakfast, don't go for a walk in your lunch break, make sure you're getting enough sleep. And, you know, it's about knowing how much you can take on your plate and creating boundaries. And that's uncomfortable because we all want to be able to do more for our clients and do more for our business. But there's that equilibrium that we kind of need to find when it comes to that balance of how much we can do without burning out and what we need to do for self care to maintain that optimal performance in the long term. Love that random question.

25:28

I always am interested when some people will say, I don't believe you can have it all. Or you can you can have it all just thought at the same time. And we question that, right? Because I believe that what everyone wants as having it all is different. Yes. So for me, I have no interest in having a really successful business with an unhappy marriage or unhappy kids or a disconnected relationship with my kids. Or I went to a stage where the more successful I got the unhealthier I got it was like, Yeah, celebrate that with going out for dinner glasses of champagne chocolate on the light chocolate in front of the TV like thing. I would love to understand if someone came into you and was talking about, I want to be able to have it all. But I know it's not possible, or do you feel like women can have it all when it comes to business? And success in that space? 

26:21

I think it's important to go back to your point of well, what is all to begin with? And that is really different for everybody. And I think that's the key that you have to bring people back to in going or what what do you mean by all like, how big do you want your business to get? You know, what sort of connection do you want with your partner? How involved do you want to be with the kids when it comes to after school sports, and you know, all of that sort of stuff, because that is different for everybody. And I think that, you know, most people, when we get down to core values, which is a part of psychology, in short, is figuring out what's important to you, you can have it all in terms of what you want. Specifically, there's give and take. But there's a level of comfortableness that you have to find, once you find that when it comes to the balance of work and lifestyle on family. It's a really lovely, comfortable spot to be sitting in. And I want every woman to be in that space. Yeah, yeah, passionate about women setting up their business from a sales perspective, because a lot of the time if I can take the money stress out of it, yeah. And they've got the ability to focus on other elements of life. So they know that if they turn on the marketing tab, and clients are nicely flowing in and they know how to manage and all and all of that. They can turn off their business, turn off their computer, turn off their screen, and go and be soccer mom, go to soccer training, do homework, play arts and crafts, which I don't do, because I don't like Macy's or whatever, whatever.

27:45

story, but you know what I mean? And I feel like it's something like that, I believe that if we have the support around us, and supporting business can look like physical people that can be team, it can be mentors, it can be coaches, it can be all of that it can just be having business buddings, where you don't want to have those conversations of like, you know what I'm having one of those moments where everything feels frickin hard, you know, but I also believe that it's about having the support around you, from your GP, from psychologists from that mental health side of it going Do you know why? I am going through a bit of a hard time, I know where I'm going, what I want to do and what that looks like. So I love how passionate you are about this stuff. 

28:26

And I love the conversations we've had about this, even off air in inverted commas. So and I love that you and I think along the same lines of yeah, we can have it all depending on what that looks like. Yeah, for sure. And I think as well, just acknowledging that it's not a straight line, right? Like there's going to be peaks and troughs. But it's you get to a point where you can be okay with that to go Yeah, it's I'm in a bit of a trough right now. And I'll get out of it. And then enjoy the highs and enjoy the lows with that. Without you know, that low being catastrophic. Without it being the end of the world and end of your business and end of your your relationships and everything like that. It's it's about coming to that balance point where yeah, there's, there's dynamic movement, but overall, you are content with where you are in life and your career and your family relationships and all of that. That's that's the aim of the long term game. Yeah. Love that. Love it, love it so much. And I think you and I are in such a beautifully blessed position to be able to be doing what we love and what we're so passionate about, although our our lines of work are very different, but also very much intertwined, right? Yeah, for sure. Yeah. And I think it's the underlying elements of an AR have that support, whether it's the GP, the psychologists or the sales processes and systems to make sure that you're getting to where you want to go in a really happy and content way. Like the puppy dog out the window with his tongue out like that's what I see is happiness and balance in life. Yeah, I mean, that's what everyone wants, right? Like we work so hard when it comes to business as well. So hard to make things work that you want to make sure that you're enjoying life.

30:00

And you touching the things that make you happy, whether that's yeah, being able to go out to a lovely restaurant with your family on a Friday night and to be able to disconnect and enjoy it. That's that's such an important part of, of business and in life in general, really, absolutely. Tell me what sort of support you give to women need business, if they do feel like they're struggling. Yeah. And look, you know, half of the reason our Creator we created our program is because of the time concerns that everyone has, sometimes it's a big step to commit to, you know, seeing a psychologist or you know, signing up to an eight week program or a longer program. 

30:35

So I think in terms of our support in our program, like I said, it's for the keen beans, you could smash that over brunch on a on a Saturday, right, it takes three and a half hours, you can sit there wake up in the morning and be done by the time the rest of your family wakes up for, for brunch trying to get over a few days. But it's a stepping stone resource there for people to get the ball rolling in short, and I think sometimes we need a stepping stone resource when you're feeling really overwhelmed. Sometimes when I see patients and they're struggling, and you know, we talk about referring them even to a psychologist, they're a bit apprehensive because they're like, I can't manage things with business and life and family as it is, how on earth do you expect me to fit in time to see a psychologist for X number of hours, and in all this, and the financial costs and all of that. So I think our program is a great stepping stone resource to help you get the ball rolling to begin with, we've also got a heap of free resources on our website in terms of just little changes that you can start to make to get the start feeling better and reduce symptoms. So things like the diet, exercise and sleep stuff, lots of information about what to expect when you do go in to see the GP or when you do go to see the psychologist because that's scary as well. No one likes being in a situation where they don't know what's going on, and what's going to be asked and all of that. And I think you know, with business, being prepared, we know is so important on so many funds, and this is no different. So we've got a resource that will go through, for instance, all the questions your GP is going to ask you in a mental health consult. Not that you need to be prepared like you would for a job interview. But it just helps you feel a less bunny in the headlights. I suppose when you're being asked that question, could we ask questions like, you know, in three to six months, where would you like to be? And what are your long term goals. And you know, if you weren't expecting that one, often

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it gets through this weekend with birthday parties and life.Totally, I've got this, you know, deadline coming up on me by bots, not just like me, or whatever it is, it's very short term. So having the time to think about that, and you know, share that with your clinicians, that's so important. Because the people that have the best outcomes are the ones that have actually thought about this stuff. Because I'll tell you what, I can have my medical criteria and my kind of checklist that we come in in three to six months and see how you're progressing from a medical point of view. But the best thing I can do is go back to your goals and go Oh, so you know, Maria, you mentioned that you want to be able to do this, and go out and date night with your partner at least once a fortnight and catch in with you, you know, catch up with your kids and have a bit more reading time together? How are you going with that? And when you say, Yeah, we're doing that now. Like we're connecting, and I'm getting more time with family. And I've been able to, you know, have this time for this aspect of my business and compartmentalize things and I'm feeling good about it, that then creates positive reinforcement in motion, and then you keep going and going and going get better. So, you know, we always have to run with mental health, we're not treating a condition, we're treating you the person. That's the important aspect. It's individualized care. And so, you know, even with our online program, even though it's self directed, you're doing it by yourself, a lot of the advice we're giving you is to think about your personal situation, and then apply it. So yeah, pop on our website, which is www dot the cloud gp.com.au. And there's a heap of free resources and check out the program to get to get started. Perfect. And we'll have all of that in our show notes as well. So pop quiz question, though. So where would someone go to like, what stage? Would someone go to the cloud GP? Do I go to the cloud GP? Before I see my GP? Do I see my GP then go to the cloud GP? And do that while I'm waiting for the psychologist or what what would that look like? Yeah, great question. So the majority of people go into our program, when they've seen the GP, they've been diagnosed with depression or anxiety, you know, mild to moderate depression or anxiety. And now they're waiting, twiddling his thumbs to see a psychologist and they can't get in to see anyone. So that's when most people do get into into our program and to get the ball rolling. But I will say that there have been a few patients that have done our program, even before they've seen the GP, or people who have come to see me, for instance, and maybe I've seen a wife for some unrelated knee issue, and she's gone. My husband just won't coming to see you. He refuses to come in. He knows he's struggling, but he just won't get help. And I'll go hey, would you consider doing this and it's anonymous, it's non confrontational. And so there are people that are doing the program before they actually see the GP. And that's actually how we've set it up. We've set it up even though for the people that have seen the GP we started as if you have never seen a GP before you're coming in to see me in my clinic from the start. And the reason we do that is that as much as I'm a GP and I have great calm

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Because I support the profession, I know that medicine is changing. And I know that it's becoming more reactionary than preventative. And I know that there are very few people that are getting the holistic management when it comes to lifestyle advice, sleep, diet, exercise, people that understand their condition, people that understand what the psychologist is going to do, I can't tell you how many people fall off the wagon because they don't understand why the psychologist is asking about their parents divorce, you know, when it comes to their mental health, like I don't want to talk about that, I just want to sort out the now because they haven't been explained in terms of oh, we kind of need to go back there. And think about how you think and why you think the way you do, why you view the world the way you do and sort of reframe things. So if those processes aren't explained to people properly from the start, and they haven't got good foundations from a holistic well-being point of view, we can do as much psychology as we want. And we can, you know, throw medication here and there, but we're not going to get the outcomes we want unless we've got a solid foundation. So I think the majority of people are coming up saying the gap and waiting to see the psychologist. But there are most certainly people coming to online learning and self-directed learning with our program who are yet to see someone because they're feeling a bit apprehensive or overwhelmed and just want to assess the situation out. Yeah, the reason why I asked that is because as I said before, I know that I go through peaks and troughs, and be aware of my mental health, because I don't want to go to that burnout stage where I have been before. And so I was like, Well, if I knew that there was something going on, and kind of starting to bubble a bit, would declare GP be something I could go in and be like, right, I know, I'm having a moment or I know that I haven't been feeling myself for the past week. I need a little bit of a tune up or a fine tune type. Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. Would they be there for a tonight because we're, we're very practical, you know, I've cut all the fluff out, I could have done this over, you know, a 12 week mastermind or something, but I was like, nobody has time for that. 

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Nobody had the energy and everyone's experiencing the overwhelm. So when you say to pick all the good bits of what I've been telling patients over the past 15 years, and just stick it down and get it really short, so that we can provide practical advice and get you thinking about what do you need to do to improve your specific situation. And even with the psychological exercises that we do, you know, we've got PDF, downloads and resources, which you can go through and work out the problems you're experiencing the stuff that's keeping you up at night, that just your head keeps going round, and round and round, we help break it down, so you can get a good night's rest, we help with things like social connection, we've got a really good resource for friends and family of people who are struggling with mental health, because that dynamic is an interesting one that we often overlook.

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I can't tell you how often I might be in clinic, and I'll have the person struggling sitting there, quietly and solemn, and their partner will come in and go, Well, this is what they've gotten them. I've told them to do this. And I've told them to do that. And they don't want to do it. And you can see the dynamic and the you know, the grating there that's just adding to the problem despite best of intentions. So we've got some great resources to help with that dynamic as well in terms of providing non judgmental practical support. Fantastic. I love it. So if you are listening to this and you feel like you have or you're in one of those kinds of times where things are really freaking hard, whether it's hard in your business hard in life, and you're feeling like what I call blah, it's like, you're not thriving, but you're also not completely parently literally in bed, crying your eyes out every day, then go and check out Dr. Sharon, his stuff. She's amazing at what she does, we are both similar in that we just cut the fluff, like what do we need to do to move forward? What do we need to do to get results? What do we need to do to take action to just move us forward? And so I absolutely love that. Thank you so much for having us today. Before we wrap up, I would love if you could give us maybe three or five main tips about how as business owners with juggling the stress the life the

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growth, mindset stuff that can come up for us, what are three or five things that we can do that we can implement today and move forward with that are going to help us keep mentally on track to our business? Yeah, great. Number one, get a good GP now, right now. So I don't mind whether you are feeling great or not feeling great. I want you to establish, you know, within the next month or so, find a great GP you might go in to see them for a flu shot, or you know, to have a chat about having a cervical smear or something else, suss them out and just feel like you have got someone there in your back pocket, who you trust and who's a good person so that down the track. If you are struggling, you know, you can go to that person and you're gonna be less reluctant to stay at home and wait for things to get really awful before coming in. You can just go in when things when there's cracks like you were saying before that blast feeling. So that would be my first tip. A second tip would be social connection would be to make sure that you've got like minded people around you from a business point of view. So to make sure that you're connecting with other entrepreneurs, you know, friends in business and being open about not just talking about the stats and the business side of things, which I'm not an expert on, but talking about the struggles quite openly and not being

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scared to be vulnerable that that not feeling like you need to put up a front when it comes to that stuff. And I think the next tip would be if you are struggling to sit down and write it down on a piece of paper, what you're struggling with in really clear bullet dot points to figure out, okay, what is it that's making me unhappy right now, because sometimes it all just kind of rolls around in your head, it's not very specific. But if you write it down, you will kind of be able to compartmentalize it and be like, Oh, this is a business thing. And I think I need to get this person to help me with this. Or this looks like a lifestyle thing. This sucks, like, I might need to see my GP for it. And then we can actually figure out how to help you and how to help you move forward. Rather than that just being this big cloud of overwhelm. So to compartmentalize and actually write things down, whether it be sleep, whether it be relationships, whether it be an aspect of your business, and then think about the practical things are the people you can involve to get the problem fixed. They love it. Awesome.

Thank you so much for joining us say on the sales show.Dr. Shiromi I was so grateful that you were out there helping more women in business and business owners really take on that mental health and make sure that they are strong enough to really get through what it is that they're wanting and things like that in life. So thank you so much. All the details will be in the show notes. I look forward to seeing you on the next episode of the sales show.

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Thank you so much for listening to this episode of the sales show. Please share it on social media for your friends to see and make sure you tag me at MareeKirkPatrick so I can personally say if you would like to show me some love, leave me a review on Apple podcasts. I'd love to hear from you email me at podcast at MareeKirkPatrick.com. And if you'd like to work with me further or see any of the free resources mentioned on today's show that can be found at MareeKirkPatrick.com I truly hope this podcast provides useful information and so much value to you. So you can build a business with impact and Income